Whatever Happened to Deaf Unity?
During the Gallaudet protests, the emphasis among the protesters was Deaf Unity. All together, deaf people of all types, deaf of deaf, deaf of hearing, mainstreamed, oral, hard of hearing, deaf people using cochlear implants, and cued speech users united along with their hearing peers to stand up against management by intimidation and flawed administration. Though the protest was tense at times, the unity was beautiful to behold.
However, after the protest as everyday activities slowly resumed, friction between the deaf groups re-emerged. People of different groups looked at each other with skepticism and intolerance.
New labels replaced the old ones. Pressure were applied against people to conform to one type of groupthink, despite their diverse cultural backgrounds and communication methods. Refusal led to criticisms of these individuals. People who disagreed with a certain kind of thinking were given derogatory labels, as if their thinking was wrong.
What happened to embracing of diversity among the deaf people witnessed during the protest?
Has Deaf Unity been flushed down the drain again?
Was Deaf Unity a temporary mirage, out of reach?
Divided, we are weak. Together we stand strong.
Let us try anew and work toward Deaf Unity again….reach out to each other and embrace the diversity within the Deaf Community with new understanding. Replace the rejection with acceptance.
Despite our communication differences, deep down, we all have a common bond.. we are deaf.
Let’s hope for more unity in 2008
P.S. I need to elaborate further on the Deaf Unity witnessed during the Gallaudet Protests. I was referring to the protesters only. Pro Fernandes fans felt otherwise, seeing how they tried to divide the Deaf Community by using the slogan Not Deaf Enough. MZ
During the Gallaudet protests, the emphasis among the protesters was Deaf Unity. All together, deaf people of all types, deaf of deaf, deaf of hearing, mainstreamed, oral, hard of hearing, deaf people using cochlear implants, and cued speech users united along with their hearing peers to stand up against management by intimidation and flawed administration. Though the protest was tense at times, the unity was beautiful to behold.
However, after the protest as everyday activities slowly resumed, friction between the deaf groups re-emerged. People of different groups looked at each other with skepticism and intolerance.
New labels replaced the old ones. Pressure were applied against people to conform to one type of groupthink, despite their diverse cultural backgrounds and communication methods. Refusal led to criticisms of these individuals. People who disagreed with a certain kind of thinking were given derogatory labels, as if their thinking was wrong.
What happened to embracing of diversity among the deaf people witnessed during the protest?
Has Deaf Unity been flushed down the drain again?
Was Deaf Unity a temporary mirage, out of reach?
Divided, we are weak. Together we stand strong.
Let us try anew and work toward Deaf Unity again….reach out to each other and embrace the diversity within the Deaf Community with new understanding. Replace the rejection with acceptance.
Despite our communication differences, deep down, we all have a common bond.. we are deaf.
Let’s hope for more unity in 2008
P.S. I need to elaborate further on the Deaf Unity witnessed during the Gallaudet Protests. I was referring to the protesters only. Pro Fernandes fans felt otherwise, seeing how they tried to divide the Deaf Community by using the slogan Not Deaf Enough. MZ
December 31st, 2007 at 12:30 pm
You guys all banded together real well to get Jane kicked out of Gallaudet. However the more powerful force, evolution of the deaf, is happening in places where you cant band together to get rid of.
And you’ve resorted to the blame game and tried making people, like me, the fall guys. Blame the ones who tricked you into supporting the infant hearing screening laws.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:01 pm
Richard Roehm, you should know by now that you reap what you sow. You treat cultually Deaf people horribly, constantly bashing them and their beautiful language.
December 31st, 2007 at 1:14 pm
Mmmm…I see otherwise. I see Deaf Unity growing bigger and bigger as we push forward for OUR own Deafhood definition of Deaf and realize the immense value of natural Sign Languages for both Deaf people AND hearing people.
The unity as u desire is not happening because some of us (well maybe all of us) are STILL colonized, not having real power in the world even in Deaf world, and still denying the hard truth (shown by statistics and research) that Deaf people DO know what we need and what s best for us as a community. We have yet to declare TOGETHER that Deaf people (including babies and parents) are the BIGGEST stakeholders in everything relatd to being Deaf.
We continue to get bombarded by a few people (most likely the same naysayers throughout the Gally protests) accusing us of groupthink, etc without seeing the possibilities and positive things.
Fortunately, there is a growing number of Deaf people THINKING and acting COLLECTIVELY. I place my hope in that. Well after all what is UNITY without people debating and agreeing together and always with community at heart and not selfish selves only.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:12 pm
Nobody will talk about Deaf Unity. When the rights of being Deaf are violated by denying American Sign Language (ASL) for Deaf babies, administering hearing implants, insulting Deaf people, and so forth, do we care? Nevermind that there are more Deaf people around the world and that they’re living in inferior conditions. Our general American society benefits from not talking about Deaf Unity through a language gap between signed and spoekn speeches (yes, ASL is my form of speech!), what happens on one side (listening and speaking) matters to them, and what happens on the other, ASL, doesn’t, as much.
Several Deaf people, like Richard Roehm and to name a few, dismiss Deaf Unity as someone else’s issue and write it off by telling us that we the Deaf kicked someone Deaf (but with deficit thinking) out of Gallaudet University. The responsibility for baby hearing profiling falls on law enforcement in the United States. As citizens, we need a unity of this type to pay attention to our needs and wants and to educate that ASL is our basic human right. What’s happening on the other side (English) is that ASL is not their focus, but I’m thinking there are people on both sides who are thoughtful and passionate about our being Deaf, and would care very deeply if they took up ASL. I only have two wishes: they knew and Deaf Unity continues.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:29 pm
I agree with Ella, I believe we’re already more unified than ever before ‘cept for a few who think otherwise. Many new connections and dialog are formed. Onward! HNY. Cheers.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:39 pm
I tolerate all diversity of deaf people, as long as they treat us equally with mutual respect. I accept culturally Deaf people and ASL. However, I also respect the preferences of oral deaf people to speak verbally. I respect the wishes of cued speech users to stick with their communication mode. I respect the wishes of C.I. adults to use their C.I. even though they may use sign language or not. I respect the desire of Hard of Hearing people to listen through their hearing aids. They all don’t conform to one group. Even though all are deaf, some may not want to use ASL all the time. Some of us reject them, because their needs are different from us. In that case, how can it be called Deaf Unity if intolerance is practiced and condoned?
Yes, there is a small batch of deaf people who mock and sneer at culturally Deaf people. I am not referring to them. All groups have their own jerks and Deaf group isn’t immune. Like trolls, they all want attention, so ignoring them is the best approach
I hope this helps clarify my position Smile.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:42 pm
I think in some ways, the Deaf Community is united. But I also think it’s deeply divided. I still see bashing by the community to CI users, even when the CI users are using ASL. If people don’t conform exactly the way others like, then yeah, I do see conflict and division.
It’s a mixed bag to me.
December 31st, 2007 at 2:47 pm
I don’t see ‘Deaf’ unity much. I think all the Gallaudet issue did was polarise not unite, it exposed perhaps the myth we are ‘all in this together’ we clearly are not, and there were no holds barred against deaf or HI who disagreed was there ? pockets of ACTIVISM are united, whether deaf people are….
It would be naive to suggest deaf people were united against Fernandez they weren’t, nor King Jordan, there was a view if deaf people can turn on their own so quick, after voting them in for the first time, loyalty doesn’t stand for much, deaf are pretty unforgiving…. Accepting diversity means you HAVE to accept the critics, to ignore or trash them, isolates YOU, no-one else. There is still a curious ‘In glorious Isolation, we will thrive’ attitude, that frankly is stupid, and unsupported.
The UK has not been ABLE to launch any campaign in 7 years of any note, their central group and voice is battling bankruptcy in cash and membership terms. The desperation showed when they tagged onto the Gallaudet issues which the UK had no chance of influencing at all, they tried a ‘camp’ too, which was unsupoorted by any group in the entire UK and fizzled out after 2 hours..
There ARE great campaigners on the 3 way platform of Deaf, deaf and HI, but on a major issue only the differences get aired, not the unity. When you have 3 opposing systems (Communication),then the basic adhesion of language isn’t there to build on, it’s why the ASL/BSL user HAS to go it alone, because few others are supporting sign as a primary mode, when that happens, can unity ever happen ?
Mishka defined this ‘deficient thinking’ pretty well on her blog, the fact is no common communication means there can be no unity (Unless you accept text !). BSL deaf can’t follow ASL, ASL deaf can’t follow BSL deaf it’s pretty much a recipe for non-cohesion. The only COMMON factor seems to be text, not sign language….
December 31st, 2007 at 3:05 pm
A Deaf Pundit is right about divide into deaf people.
all diversity of deaf people are still divide into many groups of deaf community. A small group of deaf don’t agree with the deaf babies who has right to ASL. Another a small group of deaf won’t identify themselves deaf.
December 31st, 2007 at 3:19 pm
The Deaf community appears divided to me, wasn’t there a recent controversy over “deficit thinkers”? Come to think of it, isn’t using the term “deficit thinkers” in itself a wedge used to divide the Deaf?
Here’s hoping the coming year will see more unity and less division!
December 31st, 2007 at 3:43 pm
note- i use capital D here in the spirit of how Woodward introduced the distinction. he said small d deaf was to signify a medical condition. big D was to signify a people / cultural view
I am not using it how many people today are twisting it to mean Big D means strong Deaf, ASL user, Deaf family, Deaf school and small d means a not culturally Deaf person
———————–
I think Deaf unity still exists
to me the opposite of unity is isolation. there are several very ACTIVE and VOCAL people on either end of the extremes who are acting in isolation and throwing monkey wrenches into the development and potential of a collective consciousness
MZ advise of ignoring the extremists on either end may have some wisdom. What i try to do myself is to examine what it is they r trying to tell me and where they r coming from – there is usually some wisdom i can take away from it but at the same time it has been very ugly, antagonistic, counterproductive, and hostile lately. this reduces if not eliminates the potential for being able to receive their message
If i recall right – there was not total unity during the Gallaudet protest – there were plenty of naysayers and opponents and still are but overall the number of folks finding a common ground and goal for a new search process to be established came together and overcame
I think some times Deaf unity appears to be fragile and fragmented when:
1. there is no clear shared goal
2. when a few very vocal / active sour apples try to stir up disagreements
for number 1. SHARED GOALS since the Unity for Gallaudet protest that have emerged and expanded via the blog/vlog world:
A. Bilingualism as a birthright for all Deaf children
B. Stopping of HFEB in U.K. (banning of use of “diseased” gamete / embryo
C. International Day of Sign Languages and Deaf People
D. awareness of concepts like audism, Deafhood, and Deficit thinking
Re: #2 Sour apples
this component has tried to divide and erode Deaf unity by attacking any and all forms of unity and activism and by spreading misinformation and engaging in labeling
i am not speaking of any opponent who questions and challenges – that is good, fine and needed
im talking about those who work tirelessly to engage in personal attacks, mocking, ridiculing, distortions and distractions
i have seen it on both sides and it saddens me completely
I think there are many goals we all can agree on to find that common ground
—————
once we can approach each other from a loving place we concur fear
once we concur fear we can choose unity over isolation.
once we choose unify we can become empowered instead of perpetuating learned helplessness
once we become empowered we can concur apathy and choose activism
—————-
the challenge for me personally is i very much want to be engaged in positive activism – I have to examine if i am: (four agreements by Ruiz)
impeccable with my words
not taking anything personally (good or bad)
making assumptions
and doing my best given the circumstances etc
there seems to be another very central issue we need to come to terms with -
the Deaf world is S-M-A-L-L
everybody seems to know everyone else’s business
everyone seems to have memories like elephants
everyone is carrying so much baggage that it weighs us down that we can not reach our hand out to our brother and sister for help for fear of:
being rejected
being slapped
being ignored
being outsed etc
ALL small disenfranchised groups face this dilemma
African-Americans, Gays/Lesbians, etc all struggle with unity. With in the Jewish community – what it means to be Jewish varies from group to group etc
divide and conquer is the rule of the day
communication diversity has contributed to this division much like artificial geographical boundaries the colonizing european countries created dividing tribes, people, languages, and nations in Africa and every other lands they set foot on
so has been done to the Deaf community – we have been stamped and marred by artificial communication boundaries
SEE, Cued speech, ASL, hearing aids, cochlear implants are NOT the enemy
the enemy is the system that enforces these differences upon the unsuspecting family and child
These communication differences have divided and conquered us
I am hard of hearing and joined the Deaf-world late in life. I have been welcomed and loved by far more Deaf people than by those who have given me a cold shoulder. While i have experienced some harsh judgment and rejection by both ends of the spectrum – i have learned that is more about the individual snubber than a reflection on a larger group and its not my job to take that personally. the majority of my experiences have been very positive and welcoming
now the above does NOT mean that Deaf people who use cued speech, signed english, sim com, ASL without mouth movement, CI, etc are not my brothers or sisters
they are and ALWAYS will be
it seems to me that if Deaf people are “suffering” from anything – it is “the scar of rejection”
Deaf people regardless of what language they communcate in have experienced harsh rejection
to me the saddest thing is when we experience it from each other
this is why love to me is central
sorry to have gone on so long
i think this question is a very IMPORTANT one
how do we find our common ground and UNITE
hence my long response
thanks to each and all who CARE so much about the Deaf community
i think its time we stop playing tug a war
consider forgiving others for any past transgression we feel was committed against us and move forward together!
all movements have growing pains – its expected and normal
coming from love and peace will go a long way to reduce the pain and help us all to feel welcomed,loved and ONE
also really look around – OUTSIDE of the blogsphere – that is the real world and in the real world i have far more friends than i do enemies. The Deaf community is very diverse indeed at the same time it is one of the most united diverse communities i have ever seen. Many of my hearing students are often commenting on how the Deaf-World is such a unified, diverse, and beautiful community
even if we have some disagreements and differences of opinion – overall we have one UNIFYING underlying commonality – we r all People of the Eye
peace
patti durr
MZ – im very sorry for the long comment – if u prefer i move it to my blog http://www.blog.deafread/pote
ill do that and ping it here instead
December 31st, 2007 at 4:02 pm
Some people confuse the ideas of friendship and citizenship. For example, anti-discrimination laws do not apply to people who are looking for a roommate to share an apartment. People have different interests in life, and it makes sense that they will choose their roommates (i.e, friends) on the basis of their particular interests.
A similar thing happens at Gallaudet or elsewhere in Deaf culture. Birds of a feather flock together. People who have common interests will gravitate toward one another and become friends. That’s *good*, not bad. That’s the meaning of friendship and the core of personal relationships and part of finding happiness in life.
At the same time, while it is proper to be selective in choosing friends, one can also be very open in terms of citizenship and be open in interacting with one’s fellow citizens in society.
We shouldn’t blur the concepts of friendship and citizenship. Those are different concepts.
December 31st, 2007 at 4:02 pm
Beautifully stated, Patti. I love your way of thinking
You are right about anger and pain from our bad experiences dividing us. How can we heal and move forward to Deaf Unity, accepting everybody who are deaf? Can we envision a deaf World where deaf people will not be bashed for using ASL, for being able to speak clearly or not at all, or wearing C.I.s by other deaf people? I hope so
December 31st, 2007 at 4:07 pm
Yes, we have been deeply divided, and the reason is Milan 1880 and afterwards that drove a wedge between those who sign and those who don’t.
Our deaf community was torn in half by that fateful meeting, and a whole system of practices, philosophies, judgments and even religion was built around teaching the deaf to SPEAK. For many years, speaking equaled education and intelligence.
It was well-intentioned hearing people who did this to deaf people. Many words came up to describe its different facets: oralism, “natural language” and audism. But still HEARING concepts.
We need to develop a culture that accepts all d/Deaf people just as we are, using whatever aids and communication systems we choose, and instills in everybody the philosophy that we are all in this situation together: to find our places in the world and draw up our own terms to meet it in our unique, individual ways.
In the global acceptance of our diversity, we also make room for our own sharing and tolerance. With emotional baggage stripped away from sign language, it becomes a language like any other, worthy of learning and respect.
Like Martha’s Vineyard, we can become a community where it matters not what style of communication we use, for everybody is accepted as equal. In time, we could all be using whatever language feels most comfortable at the moment with each person, and nobody would suffer the “hearing on the forehead” insult.
There would still be those who want to divide, for reasons of their own…such as sales, competing for grants, playing the audism theme, for personal or professional profit. These need to be identified and told they are harming d/Deaf unity and future development.
December 31st, 2007 at 4:11 pm
Smirky smile…..
To me it is *STILL* dividing.
Problem: it is about the attitude.
We have a long way to go….
We *MUST* respect CI users not matter *who, what, how, why, what* they are.
Deafpundit is right…it’s a mixed bag. I do not think that the word, “Deafhood” is an appropriate word, it’s like “it’s for the deaf only.” I feel like it’s the “blindhood”, “amupteehood”, or else. As far as I can see that there is *STILL* arguable on both sides.
December 31st, 2007 at 4:12 pm
typo above re: concur – should read conquer
sorry
peace
patti
December 31st, 2007 at 4:29 pm
MZ and Ella
u both mentioned HOPE
HOPE is my theme lately
H – hope
O – offers
P – possibilities
E – everyday
i truly BELIEVE our unity will multiply – some will decline the journey – some will come late – some will hang back – some will not be aware we even left
but hopefully the most important folks – the children – will see and believe and have HOPE too
in terms of the HOW to make a vision become real – it starts with each of us forgiving others and mostly ourselves for any harm we have caused in the past year or prior so we can start anew
write them down burn them up and say – amen – dont revisit and repunish (4 agreements again)
below are two quotes that i have been reciting a bit to forge me on
this dialogue and others i have been having r such good food for the soul
thank u all for refueling my hope for the new year
time for me to go play in the snow with kids and puppy
peace much
patti
————
Cornel West (African-American scholar and theologian)
“The categories of optimism and pessimism don’t exist for me. I’m a blues man. A blues man is a prisoner of hope, and hope is a qualitatively different category than optimism. Optimism is a secular construct, a calculation of probability. Black folk in America have never been optimistic about the future – what have we had to be optimistic about? But we are people of hope. Hope wrestles with despair, but it doesn’t generate optimism. It just generates this energy to be courageous, to bear witness, to see what the end is going to be. No guarantee, unfinished, open-ended. I am a prisoner of hope. I’m going to die full of hope. There’s no doubt about that, because that is a choice I make. But at the same time, the end doesn’t look too good right now.”
Tony Kushner – Gay Playwright and Activist:
“But hope isn’t a choice, it’s a moral obligation, it’s a human obligation, it’s an obligation to the cells in your body, hope is a function of those cells, it’s a bodily function the same as breathing and eating and sleeping; hope is not naive, hope grapples endlessly with despair, real vivid powerful thunderclap hope, like the soul, is at home in darkness, is divided; but lose your hope and you lose your soul, and you don’t want to do that, trust me,”
————-
I wish u all a happy and HOPEful new year!
December 31st, 2007 at 5:18 pm
D/d distinction only divides. Why do we need to distinguish d between D? We’re all deaf aren’t we? I hope 2008 brings less division and more empathy to include all spectrums of deaf people.
HNY~
December 31st, 2007 at 5:36 pm
Good comments pdurr, however I disagree on one cute point. “D. awareness of concepts like audism, Deafhood, and Deficit thinking”.
I am just concerned about their attitude and how they spread the information as well as educating all others. The biggest issue I have is that they often don’t do their education and ministry strictly out of love nor with accuracy.
Your neighbor,
WAD
December 31st, 2007 at 6:33 pm
WAD,
Can you be more specific? Thanks in advance
Deaf Unity isn’t accomplished by force-feeding others one’s concept of DeafHood. We need to examine ourselves and our uniqueness, and accept each other with respect. Some people are content with their deaf identity without purchasing into DeafHood, yet they don’t see themselves lacking. I think this concept isn’t universally understood.
December 31st, 2007 at 6:35 pm
The commenters have said many interesting statements about their theories why there are divided deaf communities.
I think that it is all about colonialism.
The deaf communities are divided between colonialized and de-colonialized thinking human beings of their beliefs about how deaf babies and children should be able to function fully with so many “invented” mode of communications that was created since 1880 Milan.
1880 Milan Conference really turned around the Deaf people’s lives by changing their natural visual language(ASL) into a “normal” verbal mode of communication which makes it easier for the auditory society.
Not only that they(1880 Milan/AGBell) pursue the oral only method ideology that successfully ingrained the auditory society that sign language was for the “regarded” and should not teach sign language to deaf babies and children in schools, but they also colonialized the deaf society that whatever the “auditory” society(self-centered hearing people) decides for the deaf children is correct and any ideas or correct methods to educate deaf children by the deaf people is incorrect and continues to punish or demoralized any deaf human being to offer their experience how a deaf baby or child in school could be able to function far more than their biased ideology which is “Oral Only Method”, this is call colonialization of the deaf community.
Don’t get me wrong that I am against speech, but to be biased by leaving out a natural language for a deaf baby is so wrong that even United States of America is so blind and can’t see that it is so biased and self-centered ideology.
John
December 31st, 2007 at 6:52 pm
Well written, Mishka Zena!
I’m so glad that you brought it up and shared with all of us. I really appreciate all of these comments, and it helped me to know exactly how I truly feel about Deaf unity, and all of these blogs/vlogs been posted on DeafRead has been bothering me AND enlightened me at the same time.
My life as a Deaf woman is unique, and how I was raised with my hearing family who truly believed that Oralism was the only best way for me to learn and I have gone through a lot of trials and tribulations, most especially dealing with intense feelings of acceptance, rejection, isolation, alienation and hurt just because the way I grew up. I realized more and more that many of us do have some *common* with FEELINGS about how *unique* with our backgrounds. No one is exactly the same.
Our uniqueness sometimes can be perceived as an advantage AND disadvantage. Its getting harder to find some ‘commonality’ with other Deaf people nowadays.
American Sign Language is a very important part of the Deaf community, unfortunately, not every person with hearing loss do know ASL. That makes the Deaf community much smaller than I realized. That is the fact.
Off the point, Dianrez, could you kindly elaborate what do you mean by your statement above:
“There would still be those who want to divide, for reasons of their own…such as sales, competing for grants, playing the audism theme, for personal or professional profit. These need to be identified and told they are harming d/Deaf unity and future development.”
Can you, if possible, use explicit examples that support your statement?
Warm regards,
Amy Cohen Efron
December 31st, 2007 at 7:14 pm
And not only the fact that deaf community are divided with their colonialized and de-colonialized minds, but also hearing parents and speech therapist.
At the Indiana Rally recently, some of the parents and speech therapist did tell the deaf/hearing people at the rally that they support ASL but they fear that their superiors may harm their job security or demoralizes the parents about their beliefs in American Sign Language.
And not only that they wanted to let the deaf people at the rally know about their support and realization of ASL but also to continue to support ASL for deaf babies.
This really tells me a lot how dominating those people are that don’t want sign language to be taught.
John
December 31st, 2007 at 7:22 pm
yeah, Ella, yeah
go, MZ, go
we are getting there …perhaps not as fast as we would like…but we are getting there..
Peace, goodwill, and hope to all
matt
December 31st, 2007 at 7:35 pm
Dianarez said:
“There would still be those who want to divide, for reasons of their own…such as sales, competing for grants, playing the audism theme, for personal or professional profit. These need to be identified and told they are harming d/Deaf unity and future development.”
I know someone! I know a group! You wanted me to identify them, so I will be the first!
DBC!
It still sucks, you know?
*laughs*
Happy New Year!
)
Paotie
December 31st, 2007 at 7:43 pm
Amy –
You stated “American Sign Language is a very important part of the Deaf community, unfortunately, not every person with hearing loss do know ASL. That makes the Deaf community much smaller than I realized. That is the fact.”
Evidently, it is true. I have thought about my old and oral school that have two other new schools in two different states. Those two schools established in 1990′s as well as my first 100 years old school that demolished and rebuilt. Those three schools were only about 20+ years old, not the 100. I wonder the number of deaf-oral students will decline in several years from now. It should be waste of $$$ in a huge time. What a waste of money.
However, we would not let AG Bell to dominate all of us! We will prevail…..*SOMEHOW*.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:13 pm
An example out of many, most parents try to raise a deaf child the best as they can. It’s clear they would think being able to carry a conversation using voice will open more gates for the child to success in many ways. There’s nothing wrong with that. For some reason, the people who publicize Deafhood, audism, etc., appear to be disappointed and upset with the parents’ decision.
I think that approach is not right. They forget to remind themselves that these parents are just trying to raise their child to the best of their ability, and may not know all of the facts. It is not their fault that they do not know all of the facts. But I see the parents receive undeserved blame.
Hence, I continue to see the division in the community.
December 31st, 2007 at 10:43 pm
WAD,
I agree that most parents are trying to raise a deaf child the best as they can.
And many want to help the parents to raise a deaf child the best as they can but the problem is that when a deaf person in the community try to help out, this helpful deaf person gets put down by these (deficit thinking) people saying that he or she should not be involved. This is the division in the community you are talking about, these colonialized people are unable to understand this concept.
There is two kind of people, one that wants to help and the other that tells you to bug out.
And it has been proven that a deaf child can learn speech training with a teacher using ASL to explain how to speak correctly.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:08 pm
I am actually referring to the treatment deaf people get from their peers based on their ability to communication. ASL using Deaf people, oral deaf, HoH, Cued speech users and people with C.I.s. This has nothing to do with deaf babies/children and their parents. These people aren’t even discussing these issues. You are bring a foreign element to this situation. Please stick to the subject for a minute.
Some Deaf people think deaf people are deficit thinkers. Some deaf people think Deaf people are also deficit thinkers. They all think they are right and the others wrong. How would calling each other deficit thinkers be productive in resolving the cultural differences? Labels only hurt and drive us further apart, as people will dig in their heels stubbornly and refuse to conduct any constructive dialogue.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:44 pm
WAD is absolutely right in his statement. Hence, lies the problem of how to make sure parents are getting all the information. I fail to see how deficit thinking plays into this. The problem is at the very starting point that the parents find out their child is deaf is usually in the hospitals. Parents and hey, many of us would rely on doctor “what to do?” (we’re talking about any medical condition that hits us deaf, what do we do? we first ask doctors, what can be done?). Of course, any smart consumer will do research. But, many parents are distraught and they just take what the doctors tell them at face value. This is one reason why I wonder why we’re going after AGBell. I mean, this starts at the hospital. If they can make it a law that babies must register with SSA for social security number, why can’t we do something to make sure that deaf babies’s parents are given the proper information and contact information for ALL possible avenues for them to look into. Final decision rests with them after we know they have everything they can possibly have to consider. Divisions happens because people continue to use labels. Throw away deficit thinking for petes sakes.
December 31st, 2007 at 11:59 pm
I can see a mental picture of three divisions on the contiuum in your blog. The first division sits on the left side of the continuum, deeply opposed — for some political reason — to the people encultured in ASL sitting on the centre of the continuum whereas the third division (oral, CI, Cued) sits on the right side of the contnuum.
I respect deaf and hard-of-hearing people of all walks of life, but never for the life of myself would I — ever –respect an oral deaf person who is dishonest, using his true name when in forums with the people like himself but would use fake names or nicknames when in forums with culturally Deaf people. Or when he lies to a lawyer when filing a lawsuit against a doctor or a hospital for not providing sign language interpreters. People like him hurt culturally Deaf people who really really REALLY need sign language interpreters. My friends who are lawyers have told me that some oralists indeed do damage culturally Deaf people on some legal matters.
January 1st, 2008 at 12:06 am
And colonialism and many other terms. We need to stop using labels because that is what divides us. We need to look for ways to better our community, not use labels.
Mishkazena, I know that my previous response was off subject to your post, but it was in response to WAD’s comment and for that I apologize. I honestly believe that the problem with unity is that there is no respect nor civility among deaf when someone has a different view. Sometimes a view might be blindsided because no one bothered to try to understand why the person views it that way. Never mind about agreeing, sometimes listening to what others say can enlighten us to something better. Labels is what hurts the deaf community. We’ve seen it happening so often in deafread, that has got to go. WE cannot honestly expect everyone to have same view. That is so “stepford” yikes. But we can all come to a common understanding of what needs to change. It appears that most deaf want the same things, but how to go about it? that is what is dividing us as well.
HNY~
January 1st, 2008 at 12:56 am
deaf unity is great for throwing a party. lets get drunk; its the new years!
January 1st, 2008 at 1:03 am
Everybody labels everybody.
My wife is a sweet person…that’s labeling
my wife is a wonderful ASL teacher…that’s labeling
Students at U of Minnesota say that my wife is firm but good teacher…that’s labeling
We all label everyone according to their attitude or personality.
How many labels does President Bush have?
Just because you feel sorry for this person, we should not label him or her???? according to his or her attitude?
Have we suffered enough in the last 100 years of these “labeled” people that oppressed your or our beliefs.
It is time to be strong and stop being so passive.
Racism is a label, yet no one say stop using that word.
Why is it wrong for a deaf person to label someone that demoralized their ambition to respect their language, ASL?
Labeling is dividing between the good and the bad of these people’s character, selfish ideology, greed of money, personal gain, etc.
Peace,
John
January 1st, 2008 at 1:26 am
#29
You are being a relativist, implying that what’s true for one person is true merely because *he* (or she) believes it and not because it is actually true.
However, there is such a thing as right and wrong. Some people hold false beliefs. If they try to insist that their false beliefs are true, then they are wrong, plain and simple, and they should be criticized if the situation is appropriate.
By identifying the fact that they are wrong, that’s not creating a false division, that’s simply recognizing a division that already exists.
Right is right and wrong is wrong. Period.
Tschuess, everybody. Tschuess.
January 1st, 2008 at 2:01 am
John, it’s 2008 and I’d rather start the year on a good note. While I wasn’t specific on the “kind of labels” that divide. I know you’re smart enough to know what I mean and it does not necessarily mean sweet positive labels. Everyone knows that no way a sweet positive label divides.
Let’s look to the new year with a positive note and I hope we all try to find ways to get along with everyone. This is just my opinion and that doesn’t mean I expect everyone to agree with me. It doesn’t hurt to listen to everyone’s opinion on what causes the divide and figure out how to make it less of a division among the deaf. I’m for finding ways to make everyone get along. Believe me, I am. Are you sayin it’s ok get back at someone who “dis” you or even ASL? Everyone has different approach how to deal with that. I personally feel that to get back at someone with negative label is not productive. That’s just me. It just creates more problems we don’t need. Peace to you. HNY~
January 1st, 2008 at 4:54 am
Since neither Milan, deafhood, nor A G Bell means a single thing to many deaf people, where do they stand in this heirachy of deafness ? I’m wondering if I am one of those deficient thinking audists for stating the reality or not… If there is any New Year resolution to be made it is to give all these terms a rest… If the ‘Deaf’ community wants to go-it-alone say so, and stop trying to speak for everyone else, so the rest do not have to spend all their time countering the claims and accusations and discriminations they are getting as a result.
Thinking forward is a lot more pro-active than harking back to the past, which to most people is HISTORY, let’s not dwell on what’s gone, what happened 200 years ago under entirely different circumstance, is not relvant NOW.
Oralism will still survive, CI’s will advance and still be implanted, Signed English will more than likely replace BSL/ASL at some point and the deaf community such as it is defined, will exist solely online. The thing with the internet is it is a great leveler, allowing deaf people to converse with hearing on their terms, and also preventing the solitary attitude of some deaf people from gaining any ground, they get with it, or get left behind.
Let’s see 2008 as the year we all woke up….
January 1st, 2008 at 5:25 am
To the person who asked for concrete examples… Paotie is a perfect example, as evidenced by his comment. He simply attacks DBC without explaining WHY he thinks this proves his point, nor why it sucks. He’s immature and fails to consider the consequences of his words, which is why he’s a malevolent, destructive force. If he were capable of reasoned, respectful dialogue, including strong disagreement, I wouldn’t categorize him as such. However….
January 1st, 2008 at 7:04 am
Ahhhh…. cheers to unity. May respect and acceptance prevail (UNCONDITIONAL respect… backing Mishka’s point, CI, oral, cued speech, etc…) No more forcing beliefs down on our throats. No more making ASL as the “be accepted or be rejected” rule of deaf cultures. Just embrace ASL as just another language, as French, English. No more paranoia (easy said than done, I know.);o)
Deal with NOW, instead of blaming past for our imaged and real problems. Past is past. Let’s move on.
HNY!
January 1st, 2008 at 8:41 am
Number #34 –
I am laughing at John….he TRIED to label Paotie as a sociopath person in his blog recently!
You said “It is time to be strong and stop being so passive.”
How about that? Label have NEVER solved for years and years……It’s been going on forever.
Thumbs down, John.
January 1st, 2008 at 9:19 am
I am sure we all learned something from the new terms that were brought up in the DeafRead in the year of 2007, however postively and negatively. We have to still learn to AGREE to DISAGREE without going war against others. It is called respect. Respect is not easy and it is a progress, lifetime learning process for all of us. There are many different kinds of respect. Attacking, belittling, allowing bullying, etc… gives an impression of division to the general population which we don’t need that.
Now, to unity… we all have our own different versions of unity so it will be a challenge to come to it. Joey mentioned whole system thinking so I am interested in what he’d say about it this year and how we with different backgrounds could apply it to unity. Unity may come in different ways… in different places, not all at once.
Good article, thought provoking since it shows we have different ideas of how unity should be brought about.
January 1st, 2008 at 10:19 am
Respect, please.. no insulting nor name callng here
Generally people believe in what works for them. Therefore, according to them, their beliefs are not false. What people seem to forget that there is no one cookie cutter for all.
The issue I see here is that one group is convinced they are correct, however the other groups feel they are also correct. So there are a lot of finger-pointing and blaming. Everybody is entitled to their opinions, whether we like it or not. How can we resolve this if everybody thinks they are right? It becomes a battle of the wills and distracts us from the bigger agenda. We can be very stubborn, aren’t we?
In other words, are we practicing crab theory, staying in the pail, fighting with each other when we could have climbed out of the pail and do real work? Remember how much we accomplished when we united during DPN and UfG? Our differences didn’t deter us from working toward a common goal. Imagine what power we have if we could harness this power of unity again? We would be so formidable!
My suggestion is to stay away from Deaf Identity Politics with other deaf people, as it is akin a black hole and a complete waste of time as they are not going to be persuaded otherwise. Concentrate on being productive such as collecting data to document the most effective method for teaching the deaf kids and also reaching out to their parents, educating them.
Happy New Year
January 1st, 2008 at 10:37 am
Its a shame we that we continue to bicker, backstabbing, finger pointing, and disagree on another’s view.
Why was it happening? Look at schools for NOT teaching us the appropriate behavior when debating issues which was why we are seeing this happening.
Look at hearing schools, they have debate teams where students learn to agree to disagree and move on. Deaf schools don’t teach those things.
No one likes to agree to disagree, these folks likes to argue, nitpicking, name calling, etc and impose alot of damage to others
Lets focus 2008 as the year of Unity in Deafhood and debate in a mutually way where everyone share views of opinions in ways we earn respect for each other.
As for crab theory, that got to stop. Lets focus on helping those who want to succeed and give them the support to grow even bigger and better in deaf community so that hearing parents of deaf child can look at deaf community with respect. This also applies to other hearing community as well.
Happy New Year 2008 to everyone!
January 1st, 2008 at 10:37 am
Sorry for going off topic. That was not my intention. I should have been more specific. I mean in the sense of when a deaf person has a CI, we scoff at them, even though the decision was probably the parents’, not the deaf person’s. But we mock that deaf person anyway by using labels. Why? That does not make sense to me. That is not acting out of love.
That is why I question pdurr’s D line about learning more of audism, etc. I see too many of people use those words to mock other deaf who might not use ASL well, and those who have a CI. Why can’t we welcome them to our community? We could learn from each other. Diverse viewpoints are good and benefits us in the long run! ASL will still be here, and so will CIs. All deaf should feel welcome and that requires no labeling of each other.
January 1st, 2008 at 10:51 am
WAD, I see your concern in learning more about specific words. This could very easily lead to abuse of the words, creating more confusion over what the words should mean, etc. We have to be careful with the quantity and quality of educating, making sure that the myths are debunked, etc. We all have our own versions of truth and what the words mean to us. Having someone telling us what it should mean can easily be felt negative, so we react negatively. Then we’d defend ourselves, blaming hearing, Milan, etc.
Look at how long it took the AIDS activitist to educate us the facts vs myths about HIV/AIDS. We still have some way to go with HIV/AIDS just like other misunderstood diseases and disabilities and races, just about almost everything, come to think of it.
January 1st, 2008 at 11:00 am
Karen –
Well said…
In my opinion, I honestly do not think that the facts vs. myths on deaf issue are the parallel case as the HIV/AIDS. Moreover, the deaf population will decline within 20 years from now.
Think about the several deaf residential schools that already are closed. How sad.
January 1st, 2008 at 11:07 am
While it is true that everyone labels each other, that does not mean it is acceptable. We should strive to be better than that. If we stoop down to what AGBell did to us, then we’re no better than them.
I see people on both ends be furious because they’re being labeled, yet they both turn around and do the exact same behavior back to the other. That to me is very hypocritical and reeks of double standards. If you don’t like someone doing it to you, then why do you turn around and do the same thing that upsets you?
I would like to think that we all want to have high standards of conduct in the community, so everyone feels that their time is well-spent being part of us, and like others have said, we all can learn from each other. I would think that the community would be extremely boring if everyone thought and behaved the same. But that doesn’t happen, and people feel isolated, rejected and mocked upon.
It was said here in one of the comments about needing to have the truth out there. And I agree wholeheartedly. We need to have the right information out there. But how does labeling others help the right information get out there? Does labeling someone as having deficit thinking help get the right information out there? I seriously doubt it helps. Nobody’s explaining what’s wrong with those facts that were said by the supposedly deficit thinker.
And you know, I consider myself to be culturally Deaf, because I love ASL and I share most of the norms and all of those things that is scientifically considered to be part of a culture. But I am sure that there are several people out here in the v/blogosphere who do not think I am culturally Deaf, because I disagree on their methods on how to deal with some situations.
Our v/blogs are in the public eye, and we really don’t know how many people are watching, and our behavior reflects on the entire Deaf Community, and I’m sure that many deaf people who may not use ASL proficiently feel they’re lost and unwelcome, after seeing all of the v/blogs criticizing others like them. I don’t see very many v/blogs celebrating our culture and diverse viewpoints.
So yes, I still see a deep divide in the community, because not everyone feels that they can be part of us, and people still do the exact same behavior that they don’t want to be used upon themselves.
January 1st, 2008 at 11:19 am
Today, the number of our Deaf community still struggle to find the right defination of Deafhood. They are facing the big battle of the power of Babels that cause dividing many of us very deep. The Deaf unity depends on strenght of our understanding throught the book of Republic, written by Plato and also reality, knowledge , politics and ethics first before we can rebuild the strenght in ourselves. Without a national leader we can not have kind of Deaf unity. Challenge the question ” How can we rebuild the strenght throught the Deaf Unity without having a national leader???
January 1st, 2008 at 12:07 pm
I found this blog completely opposite because from my view, we are more united than before. Of course, we have some issues but if we look at the positive side, we have grown so much. That’s the bottom line.
Didn’t you realize that DeafRead have grown so much in the past year? It is one good example that we are getting invovled more and trying to figure things out. And didn’t you recognize that?
It is simply few people who are trying to divide us. Allowing some comments above are clear examples that they are the one who are trying to divide us.
Believe it or not, in the year 2007, I made MANY new friends, probably more than I made in a year since I was born. I remain very grateful for new friends who came from diverse backgrounds. I have VPed with many of them and learned so much from them and I felt great about it. Many of us are already looking forward to continue and grow in 2008.
Best of luck in your journey and I certainly hope you will find more good things to post in 2008 like you did in the past.
January 1st, 2008 at 12:15 pm
Deaf population on the decline… hmmm… perhaps, for generational deaf families. However, the population of late-deafened people will go up (especially for senior citizens, due to the 1950/1960 baby boom.) We all know that learning ASL as a second language is more challenging for older people.
I don’t know, White Ghost. Yes, you are right, more deaf schools are closing down…making it more of a challenge. So it means we’d have to adapt to the “undesirable” changes in the deaf community and change these changes into postive for us, so that it could be a kind of win-win solution for us. The question is how?
January 1st, 2008 at 12:22 pm
Yes, DeafRead had grown tremendously and I am very proud of our bloggers and vloggers for doing a great job. Likewise, I’ve made many friends, which I am grateful for the opportunity.
However, we are not as united as we were during the protests. We will always have diversity among ourselves and we could either not let the diversity distract us from the bigger agenda or reduce ourselves into internal bickering over deaf identity politics.
In what ways are the few people ‘divisive’? Why do we let them divide us when we do have the power not to let them divide us… by rebutting their statements or ignoring them. Every group has its own detractors. Censorship isn’t the answer, nor using derogatory terms, belittling them. How is that productive?
Why not find a common ground and work toward that without trying to conform people to our expectations? I think everybody agrees on the deaf baby signings.
January 1st, 2008 at 12:47 pm
Okay, deaf babies being exposed to visual language, is something that the majority of us agree on (even Paotie and Mike agree on this concept of the deaf babies signing ;o) ) So we have to agee on one thing… we really need to stop appearing hostile toward AGBell (if you looked up its site, you’d notice that it did not attack ANY organizations… it just stuck to its own articles, research, etc. Hearing parents would be more willing to participate in DBC if there were no emotional whinings/bemoanings about AGBell oppressing deaf babies.) We do need to appear more professional, backing with facts (bibliography notes and published statistics, please.) Etc., the kind that would attract hearing people.
Also, we could relax the requirements of being part of the deaf culture (must be deaf by the age of 5 years old, know ASL as first language, from generational deaf families, to name several…) which are seen as a turn off for mainstreamed, oral, CIed population.
Well, we need to start somewhere.
January 1st, 2008 at 1:02 pm
Deafpundit has a point. Well written, Deafpundit.
Joey, how can we untie if we are forced from disagree to agree? Look at the democrats and republicans. They do not agree on many issues for years.
You stated “It is simply few people who are trying to divide us. Allowing some comments above are clear examples that they are the one who are trying to divide us.”
Are you saying that you are trying to blame the commenters who are disagree with you? There are millions of deaf and hard of hearing people all over the USA who are disagreeing with you and do not want to make the comments.
Be careful what you are saying, Joey.
Karen, I often thought about that “the question is how?”
January 1st, 2008 at 1:17 pm
White Ghost,
What makes the “how” question interesting is that we all have different ideas of how to make “how” to happen. That is where differences come in to play and that leads to disagreements and to divisions, just like our different perspectives which do not mesh with other people’s perspectives.
So it seems, we need to start acknowledging each other’s differences. But I do notice that we mostly agree that the deaf babies/toddlers/children need to be exposed to visual languages to help develop their cognitive abilities. Look at Asian and Indian children easily breezing through the Spelling Bees… whoa! So it tells us something… As for adults, yup, we need to focus on acceptance of each other, even when we don’t agree with them.
January 1st, 2008 at 1:22 pm
There seems total ignorance of how other deaf have different views to each other ! People will always disagree, it’s human nature. We get a mixture of views in response regarding deaf babies, deaf education, CI’s, the deafhood thing, there are a dozen issues running alongside each other that’s the problem. As soon as you find common ground on one, there is huge division on another, it’s just two camps, one is for deafness and deaf culture and all that goes with it, the others want an end to it, want BSL replaced with something else, oralism used etc, when push comes to shove that is why consensus is impossible. Deaf culture feels under threat, and a very real one with the latest genetics going on too, where a governemnt has condemned their deafness as unwanted. There IS no middle ground, is there ? We may all be deaf or with hearing loss, but I think that is the sum total of it….
January 1st, 2008 at 1:35 pm
I agree and support Joey.
If some of you people disagree about how some Deaf leaders are moving along, then why don’t you start up a coalition or organization and not worry about what the others are doing.
And once you set up a group, coalition or organization, these deaf leaders will not have any “crab theory” ideas or blogs about your approach of the betterment of your goals.
We need to stop supporting a few people that enjoy calling Deaf Culture, cult and coalitions sucks, etc.
This is 2008, show me what you can do, don’t tell me what you think should be done.
And the unity among the Deaf community is much stronger than last year and it is just a few people that is making the most noise just to demoralize the ambitions for deaf babies to learn a communication language at start/birth.
So show me that you care…in action..do something!
John Egbert
January 1st, 2008 at 1:35 pm
That is not s simple to resolve the question of “How can we, Deaf community overcome the battle of the power of Babels? Now why do we, Deaf Community spend time so much to obess with AGBELL? I question the hard what is the problem with us Deaf Community and stop blaming others this question what is the wrong with us Deaf Community???
January 1st, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Karen,
Whoa….about the spelling bees. I watched the “National Geographic Channel” (NGC) on TV several years ago and it was about the Asian and Indian children who have won the champs. The NGC mentioned that there are about 25 percent of children who are homeschooling that made into the spelling bee championship. Impressive, Karen?
White Ghost
January 1st, 2008 at 2:02 pm
John,
I’m trying my best to understand, but I don’t see why you and Joey cannot ignore these detractors. Ignoring them doesn’t mean supporting them. Just continue with your activities.
There is a well known slogan .. Take what you like and leave out what you don’t like. I think we will get along better if we practice that.
January 1st, 2008 at 2:29 pm
I was reading the comments and happened to see the comment made by Ms. Karen Mayes above (in #54) about the Asian and Indian children doing well in the Spelling Bees. When I was in RIT, I did a brief research on Chinese history as an assignment for a liberal arts course. I learned that the education is highly emphasized throughout the very long history of China to the point that the culture of education permeated the societies. You all may be familiar with the expression, “If you give him a fish, you feed him for a day. If you teach him how to fish, you feed him for life.” This quotation is attributed to Confucius and it is not surprising that he was the strong proponent for education.
It also is not surprising that these Asian children (I don’t know much about the Indian children) were raised in families that carried the culture of education from the Asian countries. We don’t see this in the Deaf culture, unfortunately (at least for me personally).
Joseph Pietro Riolo
josephpietrojeungriolo@gmail.com
Public domain notice: I put all of my expressions in this post in the public domain.
January 1st, 2008 at 2:42 pm
White Ghost – #53,
I did not say I am blaming them because they disagree with me. Where did you get that? It is more of HOW they comment with the words they use (choice of words). I stand by for what I say because in all of my vlogs, I have always said we need to say things postitively and it is amazing how people twist words in my mouth.
It is clear to me that this is a simply big misunderstanding between some people. I will just take Elizabeth’s advice to ignore them.
I still feel good about our movement! Upward we go!
January 1st, 2008 at 2:42 pm
” In any compromise between food and poison, it is only deth that can win. In any compromise between good and eivl, it is only evil that can profit.” I find the interested question about a proponent for education! I love the arguement about that but I would love to bring up the quotation of ” Culture is just as important as in born qualities and inborn qualitites no less important than culture. Remove the hairs from the skin of a tiger or panther, and what is left looks just like the hairless hide of a dog or sheep.”
January 1st, 2008 at 2:48 pm
Joseph Pietro Riolo,
You said,
We don’t see this in the Deaf culture, unfortunately (at least for me personally).
Our education and language was taken away in 1880 Milan and they still dominate how deaf should learn a language and how education is being taught.
John Egbert
January 1st, 2008 at 2:49 pm
Joey,
I don’t think you get it. You are denying. Sorry, you have to read your statement again.
Blaming commenters who are disagree with you is a bad example. Must not blame *ANY* commenters who are trying to divide us.
RESPECT to ANY commenters and their views. If you disgree with their views, all you can ignore them as Elizabeth’s advice. It is simple as it is.
White Ghost
January 1st, 2008 at 2:51 pm
Joseph, so you are saying that Asian families view education more important than the culture? I am trying to understand at how easy for Asian and Indian children to learn English as 2nd language… is it because Asian and Indian languages are more difficult to master than English?
Mishka, I am sorry if we went off of the point… it is fascinating to me to see the Asian and Indian last names on my home town’s school district’s website as the winners of the Spelling Bees in the middle schools (hearing of course…) I have noticed there was no English names. However, I noticed for Hispanic children, it is more difficult for them to excel in English… is it because Spanish is easier to master than Asian/Indian?
I hope I am not doing an injustice to some countries’ languages, but I am just pondering at the easiness for some countries to excel in learning English while it is harder for other countries.
So for Deaf Culture… I believe because there are no academic standards for ASL in the education system in America, it is more of a challenge for deaf children to achieve the level of academic excellence similar to Asian and Indian people. Am I correct?
January 1st, 2008 at 4:20 pm
Joseph Pietro Riolo writes:
“We don’t see this in the
Deaf culture, unfortunately
(at least for me personally).”
You make asweeping generalization
big time. I don’t see it in you,
your son or your family. I do see
it in some American Deaf people.
It’s much easier for you to
fingerpoint at ALL AMERICAN
DEAF people when you overlook
it under your big nose.
Watch your language.
January 1st, 2008 at 4:27 pm
WAD:
Your question is so unbelievable!
You asked:
“Suppose you happen to have
two kids, one is deaf and
other is hearing. The question
is: which is easier for you
to raise?”
Eyerolling!
January 1st, 2008 at 4:57 pm
John, right, our time is better spent on educating the parents the value of ASL.
Asians value education including the mastery of a language. Hispanics in general don’t emphasize on education. However, it’s not a culture more, but the socioeconomic class. The Asians here tend to come from upper middle and middle class in their native countries while the Hispanics escape their poverty-striken countries
Within the deaf community, one persistent problem is attitude. Some people do carry themselves with superior than thou manner, which strain the relationship between the groups. But it really reflect the inferior complex of the individual rather than the group, I think. Respect can go a long way, even though we disagree with their opinions, as long as they respect our right to disagree.
For WAD, where did she make that question? I checked and didn’t see it.
January 1st, 2008 at 5:06 pm
As long as the leaders of Deafhood are all Deaf there will be no Unity. Sorry. They won’t support HOH or CI issues, so it is all hypocritical.
January 1st, 2008 at 5:09 pm
Duck – tons of flying sour apples being tossed
smile
dont worry – there are some good in them me think
re: the doomsayers that predict “Deaf cultures” death in the near future – i respectfully disagree
veditz said “as long as we have deaf-mutes on this earth, we will have signs”
i was reading some work by philosopher Martin Buber that clarified that a PROPHET does not foretell ‘a fixed unchangeable future” they dont predict the future. rather ‘they announce a present that requires human choice and decision’ a present ‘in which the future is being prepared’ but whose outcome depends upon the work and decisions of human beings”
i think this may relate to Veditz’s other quote
“A new race of pharoahs that knew not Joseph are taking over the land and many of our American Schools.”
Joseph had the gift of prophecy – this does not mean that he predicted the future – this means that he “announced a present that requires human choice and decision”
Veditz in his turn was a prophet of sort – he saw the onslaught of oralism in Europe making its way across the big pond to the US and responded accordingly – he made human choices and decisions for the preservation of Sign Language and the People of the Eye
Veditz closed his famous 1913 speech with HOPE and a plea (or rally cry depending on how u look at it)
“I hope that you will cherish and defend our beautiful sign language as the noblest gift that God has given to us.”
his prophecy still applies today
if the advancement of CI devices AVI genetic screening and texting means the diminishing of ASL/BSL or any other sign language – if this is truly our present it does indeed require human choice and decision NOW
the decisions and choices must be well-informed and loving and the following actions must be peaceful
re: WADs comment re: advancing a sound and accurate understanding of audism, Deafhood and other terms (colonalism, liberation theory, deficit thinking (as it relates to schooling / educational approaches not as it is being misused in some blog comment sections) etc
i agree – yes this understanding must be developed correctly and lovingly
this resistance and desire to destort these terms coming from any or either camp befuddles me a bit
no where in the academic understanding of audism does it say – use the term against everyone and anyone
no where in the academic understanding of Deafhood does it say people who have CI or have not learned sign language are to be rejected, cant achieve Deafhood etc
many people have told me otherwise – they have said that audism is a dirty and threatening word and should be banned from use
many people have told me that Deafhood is all about promoting Deaf people of Deaf families and rejecting anyone who is not a strong signer etc
i have asked for references, sources, – no responses. often where they got this misinformation comes down to “a sour apple” or a misunderstanding or simply them having heard from someone else who heard from someone else….
and i ask “what exactly did they hear/see?” “uh, well ummmmm….”
i have scoured the primary documents re: audism and deafhood and i have not seen such statements
these r the myths that Karen wrote of
re: the comment we need a few good leaders to unify and lead us – true. i hope a leader such as the likes of rosa parks, mlk, jr, baynard rustin, mahatma gandhi can emerge before us. we r in need and very deserving of such. a leader(s) with bad intents can only hurt us all
the leaders named above experienced much hostility from within their own groups but still they presevered – they did not spend their energy trying to pursuade or convince these distractors
eye on the prize folks
in taking a few steps back – i think one central problem may be for us this term DEAF
i think despite how hard we pull and tug and try to stretch it to mean a cultural thing – it will forever for the majority be a “can’t hear” thing – no matter if we capitalize it, add -mute, highlight it etc it still for most mean a physical condition ONLY
so perhaps it is time for a new terms – divorced from the “lack of the ability to hear”
a term moved away from the “cant” view and from the “ear” sign and POV
if such a new term were to emerge i hope it would be coined in ASL (or another sign language first) and not thought of in English or the spoken / written language first
once a sign is agreed on then a written/spoken word could be tied to it
i think this might solve alot – then the folks who prefer to just identify with deaf community, being deaf as a physical thing and not a cultural thing – dont feel that a word associated with who they r is being corrupted or that they r being judged if they dont choose to use this new word
the small d / Big D invites alot of judging
the intent by woodward i think was academically sound at the time – he did not want to coin a new term but wanted to identify a distinction between the inability to hear and a cultural people
deaf is no longer seen as a bad term so it thankfully has been reclaimed as a positive but still largely is a medical term
a new term emphasizing a people – to describe a cultural group i think is long in order
then if folks feel they do not have a cultural view of themselves as a deaf person – that is their choice. they would not need to use this word
all groups wrestle with terminology. i think its time for the folks interested in examining what it means to be a culturally deaf person – to coin a new term separate from the word deaf
(negro, blacks, colored, african-american etc as just one example)
just a thought
peace
patti
January 1st, 2008 at 5:14 pm
Responding to comment #65 made by Ms. Karen Mayes:
You asked a good question that I had to consult several dictionaries to help me explain what I meant. By culture of education, I mean the general attitudes, behavior and traits that a society has for education. When a society forms attitudes (usually positive) and behavior expectations about education, they all become a culture of their own. In this case, education and culture are inseparable. This is unlike the society in our country (U.S.). Although U.S. seems to hold education very highly, it really does not have its own culture of education. It sees education as a means to an end. Once the end is reached (i.e., get a job), education can be discarded or ceased.
There is nothing magic about the Asian children. Their intelligence level is about average like the rest of the world. Their cognitive skills are about average like the rest of the world. So, what make them stand out? It is the amount of time and effort that they spend on education. The culture of education that they are bathed in every day dictates that the families and schools contribute to their education in any way.
As for deaf children, I am not sure if setting up the academic standards for ASL is an answer. The reason for saying this is that the academic excellence does not happen without a lot of time and effort on learning. Assuming that the academic standards for ASL exist, the deaf students still will not reach the academic excellence if they don’t do their homework, for example.
Responding to comment #63 made by Mr. John Egbert:
There are many hearing societies that do not have their own culture of education. Even if the 1880 Milan conference did not discourage signed languages, a Deaf culture could be still without the culture of education.
Responding to comment #66 made by Scott:
It is not necessary for the individuals in a culture to abide by the rules of the culture. It is not uncommon to see the individuals in the cultures deviate from the expectations of the cultures. On the opposite side of the spectrum, the individuals may do more than what the cultures provide or dictate. I will give an example. In the Deaf culture, the written form of ASL is not encouraged or acceptable. But, this does not stop some Deaf individuals from trying or using the written form of ASL. I have seen some Deaf people trying to instill the value of education (not the culture of education because culture takes the whole society) in their children. But, they are on their own.
Joseph Pietro Riolo
josephpietrojeungriolo@gmail.com
Public domain notice: I put all of my expressions in this post in the public domain.
January 1st, 2008 at 5:51 pm
Joseph Pietro Riolo,
you said,
Even if the 1880 Milan conference did not discourage signed languages, a Deaf culture could be still without the culture of education.
That’s your negative side of thinking
I would say,
Even if the 1880 Milan conference did not discourage signed languages, a Deaf culture could still have the culture of education…
1880 Milan with AGBell’s influence to eliminate sign language and use oral only method destroyed our language and education and you seem to think that it would have not made any different one way or another. You don’t seem to think there was any ramification of 1880 Milan decision to ban sign language.
Is that how you view deaf people?
I am disappointed in you!
John
January 1st, 2008 at 6:27 pm
Patti, I noticed at how you did not capitalize all of your sentences… I guess it is your trademark of being humble and your intention to remind us of our humility
)… that we are no better nor worse than the rest of us. Yes, you are right about what and how certain words mean to us and at how we interpret the words… which cause myths. So it is our job to find truth in myths, for myths often contain an element of truth.
Joseph, yeah, there are theories to what education succeeds for some people while it does not succeed for others. It is still interesting… you are right, education “supposedly” ends for us Americans after we achieve our jobs or whatever is a goal for us. Education should be a lifelong thing for us; learning does not stop at the graduation from high schools/colleges. I just envy the discipline that Asians/Indians impart into the education. I wonder if English as their second language help them pay more attention to delving the meanings in the rhetoric meanings of English literature, so that helps them develop highly critical thinking skills? Would it help deaf children to develop excellent memorization skills (through the repetitive recitment of English syntax) which then could help them lead to develop better critical thinking skills? I would like to see deaf children excel in English as 2nd language like Asians/Indians do, with the same teaching methods…. hmmm…
January 1st, 2008 at 7:00 pm
Responding to comment #72 made by Mr. John Egbert:
Suppose there are four possible scenarios as the following:
Scenario #1: The 1880 Milan conference banned signed languages. The Deaf culture did not develop its own culture of education.
Scenario #2: The 1880 Milan conference banned signed languages. The Deaf culture developed its own culture of education.
Scenario #3: The 1880 Milan conference did not ban signed languages. The Deaf culture did not develop its own culture of education.
Scenario #4: The 1880 Milan conference did not ban signed languages. The Deaf culture developed its own culture of education.
Your comment #63 assumed that scenario #4 would happen. I provided a counterpoint that scenario #3 also could have happened using many hearing societies as an example.
There is nothing negative about it. It is a logical thinking trying to show that just because a culture exists does not necessarily mean that it also has its own culture of education. Also, it shows that there is a possibility of non causa pro causa (“false cause”) fallacy where the ban on signed languages is assumed to be responsible (cause) for the lack of culture of education.
I am not oblivious to the effects of the 1880 Milan conference. That is the past and we can’t revise the past in the style of Star Trek. But, I do see a lot of potentials in the present Deaf people. For example, the bloggers and vloggers could be a catalyst for the culture of education.
Joseph Pietro Riolo
josephpietrojeungriolo@gmail.com
Public domain notice: I put all of my expressions in this post in the public domain.
January 1st, 2008 at 8:10 pm
after reading certain misleading comments about deaf culture, i was ready to jump in but patti said it all very well!
it is interesting to me when mz questioned “whatever happened to the deaf unity?”, some people responded positively but the other people were quick to accuse deaf of deaf, asl users, etc etc but said the deaf community must stop blaming agbell. that’s such a hypocrite. please practice what they preach – if they said do not accuse agbell, they should not accuse deaf community as well!
also, they said that deaf community must present facts with sources, etc, yet they didn’t offer sources on their claims about deaf of deaf, asl users and deaf culture. they need to stop that too! they need to stop spreading misconceptions of deaf culture in deaf community:
a) it is either you “join” or you “don’t join” = it is false!
b) deaf culture is open only to deaf of deaf; or to those who are deaf before a certain age = false!
c) deaf culture allows only people whose native language is asl = false!
if all above are true, then i would never see many deaf, hh and late-deafened people whose parents are hearing and who learned asl much later in their lives around at deaf clubs and gatherings. i have met many of them who are regular deaf-club goers; asked them about their experiences, how did they learn asl, how did they meet deaf people, etc.
i have had so overwhelming many positive experiences with all kinds of deaf people. yes, i have had some negative experiences with all kinds of deaf people but i really believe that it’s a cheap excuse for putting all blame on the deaf community as whole.
it is also interesting to see some people making stigmas about DOD’s, yet some of their children are DOD’s. i would advise against making such stigmas about DOD’s or their own children will end up fighting against them!
lastly, i notice that those who accuse deaf of deaf, deaf culture, asl users, etc tend to sit back, doing all talks and pointing fingers at people but they did not make any contributions in making differences.
ok, i’m done here.
January 2nd, 2008 at 10:49 am
Phew, MZ – over 70 comments?!!!
Like you, I’ve made many great friends on DR!
I was thinking the same thing you did… when I noticed some people coming up with terms to point at some people or what they were doing as a way of dividing them. Please don’t preach me about the system dividing us, it’s already been done for years and we do not need to further divide people based on our ideas/views.
Even some hearing people are divided into groups and others have the capability to get along with everyone regardless of their backgrounds – whether it be social, class, political, or economic.
Dear John – this quote of yours:
“If some of you people disagree about how some Deaf leaders are moving along, then why don’t you start up a coalition or organization and not worry about what the others are doing.”
That was not what you were doing when you spent so much time focusing on the “few people” that caused the great debate on “deficit think(ers)(ing)”.
It shows me that YOU were worrying about what others were doing, and then coming up with such terms for them, instead of just keep doing what you were doing.
There will always be some people who won’t like what an organization does – and I doubt such organizations would spend their energy and effort going after those people.
Ah well – Deaf Pundit has said it well – mixed bag! Touché, DP.
MZ, I’ve always enjoyed your blogs – you are one of my favorite bloggers!
Happy New Year!!
January 2nd, 2008 at 12:48 pm
I’ve been pondering over the meaning of ‘divisive’ behavior.. It appears to me having different thoughts constitutes divisive thinking. But how can we be ‘divisive’ if we all have different thinking, based on our upbringing: communication, familial, educational settings, and so forth.
Either we must conform to their singular way of thinking or we are divisive, being accused of trying to divide the Deaf Community. In other words, independent thinking isn’t encouraged?
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:07 pm
Yes, Mishka. It appears to be our perceptions… which sometimes don’t mesh well with others’ perceptions, so we/they are seen as “divisive.” Like it is happening in Kenya (blacks vs blacks) and I am sure it has NOTHING to do with colonism.
That is what I have been telling myself for a long time and teaching my children about this… that there is no right nor wrong; just differences in opinions and that we need to respect them. Still it stings when someone bashes you in front of people in the cyberworld (cyberbulling does happen among adults, not children…) Just remember that it is not your problem when someone attacks you verbally; it is his/her problem more… not understanding the meaning of respect and tolerance. We have to be examples of respect and tolerance and open-mindedness.
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:07 pm
Hello and Happy New Year!
Mishka Zena, I appreciate your intent in writing this article, which to me is focused more on the reminder that our goal is for Unity in our Community. Together we can accomplish great things! Respect for one another’s view of how to get there is important. I’m with Joey in that my focus is on the positive aspect of our community’s dialouges. How we express ourselves in our dialouges is important, and I want to reinforce Amy’s point which goes to what Karen Mayes just stated, “We have to be examples of respect and tolerance and open-mindedness”.
It seems there is a lot of time spent on the disagreements than agreements.
It would be nice to see us start the new year taking a look at what we agree on FIRST than to look at the issues various groups and/or individuals do not agree. Even if the areas agreed on are small, still is a good starting place.
The divisiveness stems from strong disagreements which more or less comes from not understanding where one another is coming from. If we took more time to understand one another, less battles will occur and more constructive healthy dialouges can happen. Our community doesn’t consist of a small group of people. Our community is quite large with many individuals from different backgrouds. Unity occurs when there are agreements and when respect is evident for the different opinions because that is when we can work together to shape and make our objectives stronger to reach our goals and, this Respect needs to be a two-way street.
With this frame of mind, I would like to point out a few things I notice most of us agree on:
1. Unity in our Community is important to us.
2. Acceptance of each other, regardless of background, to value the differences amongst us as reasons to strengthen us.
3. ASL as a language is important to us, and needs to prioritized as the visual language for early intervention starting when the baby or individual is first identified as deaf is critical to developing/acquiring language.
4. Other?
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:22 pm
Independent thinking and labeling are two very different animals.
Independent thinking isn’t the divisive thing that some people on this blogosphere think it is. Independent thinking helps readers see that there are people out there who are thinking about deaf issues seriously and with a great deal of consideration.
Independent thinking also offers ways of seeing different solutions to an issue, proving that only one solution to an issue is not a be-all, end-all answer. How many of you have made up your minds about an issue, only to change your minds later because of other circumstances or factors that weighed in? Nothing is ever that black-and-white.
Independent thinking offers insights into a problem or worthy cause that someone else is so wrapped up in that he can’t see the forest for the trees. It gives an objective outsider’s point-of-view and can be a blessing in disguise, like the Cheshire cat. It’s that zen moment of “why didn’t I see/think it before?”
But what happens so often is that this independent thinking gets misconstrued as critic-ism, as flippant sarcasm, or as insults when it is deemed the opposite of the b/vlogger’s or other commenters’ thoughts. This is where the labeling begins and labeling becomes this uncontrollable, roaring tiger.
When Paotie says “DBC sucks”, does anyone ever ask WHY instead of “How dare he?” He doesn’t go into an explanation of why, because he wants you readers out there to think on your own, do your own diligent research, and come to your own conclusions, not just take somebody’s word for it. That’s called independent thinking, readers.
If there is no tolerance or open-mindedness for independent thinking, this DeafRead will become a damn bore. The diversity in views is what makes the world go ’round. Indeed independent thinking may make unity more difficult to achieve, but it will enrich the deaf community far more than divisive labeling will.
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:37 pm
Ann_C, well written comment, explaining more about independent thinking in depth.
January 2nd, 2008 at 5:31 pm
Making a comment on comment #75 made by brenster:
You are right to question the credibility in some statements that are made or propagated by some people about the Deaf culture. But, this begs the question. Who is the authority that we can consult to determine if a particular statement is valid or not? I will provide a real example so that I will not be accused for making up a bogus example. Mr. Carl Schroeder seems to be so against cochlear implant in infants as indicated by his several blogs at his blog site http://carl-schroeder.blogspot.com. His view is shared by few other people. My question is: Is his view reflective of the Deaf culture? Or, is his view his own that is totally independent of the Deaf culture? How do we know if a particular view or statement is personal or is reflective of the Deaf culture?
Joseph Pietro Riolo
josephpietrojeungriolo@gmail.com
Public domain notice: I put all of my expressions in this post in the public domain.
January 2nd, 2008 at 10:26 pm
Joseph-
there are plenty sources that show many deaf people are against cochlear implants. i understand that you were just stating this as an example. however, this was not my topic.
my one of topics focused on acceptance into deaf community. there is not one source that says implant users are to be rejected from the deaf community and deaf culture. in fact, i already saw an increase in number of implant users at residential schools, deaf clubs & gatherings, and even gallaudet university. those are physical proofs that implant users are already accepted into deaf community.
i understand your question, how do we know if it’s a particular view of a group or just a personal belief. that would be up to the readers to make the determination. (maybe it’d be a good idea to see ella’s recent vlog discussing the “D.I.E.” approach). carl, according to your example, “seems” to be against implants for babies. i would say that it is his strong personal belief which is completely different from ‘using a personal belief to make a statement about a group.’
January 2nd, 2008 at 10:36 pm
Both brenster and Joseph Pietro Riolo had some interesting points. Brenster said:
“…please practice what they preach– if they said do not accuse agbell, they should not accuse deaf community as well!”
Well, who’s doing the accusing of agbell in the first place? the hearies? But excuse me, if there is so much criticism of AGBell by the D/deaf, what do you think HEARING parents of deaf children are going to think? Keep in mind here these parents are also hearing. It’s like an attack on their “hearing” sensibilities. It makes AGBell look better by the minute. Don’t take me wrong, brenster, try thinking like the audience you’re trying to educate for once.
Joseph poses a very good question about a b/vlogger’s view, whether it is purely personal/independent or reflective of Deaf culture? At this point in time I’d regard the b/vlogger’s view and any following comments as purely personal and not an authority. One can take or leave it.
January 2nd, 2008 at 11:55 pm
Ann_C,
you completely missed my point. therefore, i’ll not elaborate.
January 3rd, 2008 at 12:38 am
brenster,
I understood that you were discussing deaf unity, but you’re saying I missed your point. I believe many of us deaf are agreed about the benefits of ASL for deaf babies and toddlers at a critical age, but I don’t believe attacking AGBell is the right approach. Just because I differ with you and others about education of hearing parents doesn’t mean I’m being divisive. I’m actually pretty concerned about the future of the deaf.
DBC will continue to do what it wants to do, that’s the organization’s prerogative. But it’s pursuing an attack-AGBell-centric policy at all costs that will have long-term repercussions on the deaf community, on all of us deaf. Has anyone in DBC given this any thought?
January 3rd, 2008 at 3:07 am
Ann_C,
Is there any research on the effects of the protests against AGBell on the Deaf community, the public, and the parents of Deaf children?
From what I’ve seen (admittedly I haven’t seen all of the blogs or other sources yet), worrying about “long-term repercussions on the deaf community” seems to be more of distorted thoughts than reality.
However, from my observations, the “long-term positive effects on the Deaf community” is going to be real terrific and powerful. Talk about empowering! And Deaf people live being Deaf and showing consequences of our education and our parents’ choices 24/7/365 AND the more we interact with other Deaf people, the more we experience the consequences. Therefore, doesn’t it seem more appropriate to worry more about Deaf people themselves and how they are being affected by AGBell’s militant approach in emphasizing auditory verbal therapy?
To be honest, I think the amount of protest against AGBell is still far far inadequate compared to the “damage” AGBell have done to hearing parents and Deaf children that have resulted in a lot of hurt, miscommunication, unnecessary stress, and deprived education. I am quite surprised that you felt it’s “too much”. Again, is there any specific incidents, research, data showing that? And if it’s at all true, why would it be a bad thing? I’m aware this is all based on opinions, but I’m curious what you’re thinking.
In addition to protesting against AGBell, we do need to build up an excellent resource and curriculum to provide families with Deaf babies with EQUAL or more “airtime” as AGBell and its affiliates have had with the families all those years.
January 3rd, 2008 at 11:34 am
Ann_C,
i was not talking about “blaming agbell” itself. i was talking about some deaf people (A) who said that other deaf people (B) should stop “blaming agbell” yet those same people (A) were exactly doing the same thing “blaming” other deaf people (B) for other things that I have already listed in #75. That was my point.
what you tried to discuss was another topic, but since you were at it, I’ll offer my perspective.
it’s interesting to see how you and others interpret things. See, the participants held rallies at agbell confs, FACT: only to spread out information/awareness about benefits of including sign language for deaf babies. You along with others view that as “attacking” agbell. quite interesting, because i view that as positive activism to promote betterment for our future deaf generations!
when people challenged agbell’s narrow one-side approach (yes, they backed up with plenty sources), it was interpreted as “attacking agbell.”
i’ll tell one more interesting thing. some deaf people accuse the deaf community for being divisive and exclusive. from what i have seen in the deaf community, it’s opposite. look at agbell, it is very exclusive; it completely rejects sign language users who do not use speech as primary mode for communication.
January 3rd, 2008 at 12:00 pm
As you know, the topic covers the attitudes between deaf adults. But nowthat the topic is veering off again, I’ll comment on this one.
There was no protests at AGB, just educational rallies with flyers listing the benefits of Baby ASL signs and deaf babies. These rallies were very peaceful, with smiling deaf people passing around the flyers
January 3rd, 2008 at 2:54 pm
Ann_C
When Deaf people aren’t all alone, some of them attack on AGB Deaf education. Addition,the writers have attacked AGB stole the idea of telephone since a few years ago. Seth Shulman who is journaling announces that Bell pretty much stole Gray’s technical ideas and is suddenly spreading news of AGB over the states and the internet. AGB may no longer claim credit for the telephone. Both the Deaf people and the writers (hearing) pose a threat to AGB.
January 3rd, 2008 at 10:02 pm
None of any blogs or vlogs who have gut to stand up what is the problem of being unable to do something about how can Deaf unity build strength through political strategic. Nothing ever happens to be a reality, just talk, talk, talk to get you to nowhere. We must learn to see the reality of our big challenge of deep dividing that are amongst us. We need to understand our weakness due to several reasons! Why our Deaf Unity never works very well because of self-denial of ASL and Deaf! Many of Deaf educators can’t work with the grassroots. NAD often represents only special interest. From the bottom to the top I mean start with small town to national level across the country of USA! I do not believe anything about Deaf Unity. From what I have seen the history that have shown our Deaf Community has always been very weak in that politic because of very isolated from our mainstream society.Deaf unity dependson two things that must accept Deaf and ASL as a whole heart of our Deaf Community. ASL has not been recognized as a document as legitimate that could be a language right of our Deaf community but they do nothing about that! We need to focus on that political strategic of our Deaf Unity that is not so simplistic and who would pull rotten or wound weeds that always stay with our Deaf Community then what is the problem with our Deaf community that always block building the Deaf Unity!!!